So, Judge, When Did You Stop Beating Your Clerks?

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12 Responses

  1. jps says:

    Although I had heard rumors about this particular judge before Chambermaid which would make me not want that clerkship, to correct a totally false statement: Judges do fire clerks. There are several judges who are known for firing clerks. And those judges should be avoided for firing clerks. And making life hell for a clerk to get them to quit so you dont fire them- just as bad.

  2. Anon says:

    One of my co-clerks was fired, and not for any misconduct. Basically, it was just because the judge didn’t like him.

    And another judge in the circuit also fired a clerk – that one was supposedly for incompetance.

    It happens…

  3. Ann Bartow says:

    Hi Scott,

    I think there is a bit of sexism going on here too. I suspect there are many male judges who are difficult to work for but they are less attractive targets; here there is a certain “woo-hoo, catfight!” undertone to some of the commentary about the book that troubles me. I also wonder if some of Judge Sloviter’s clerks don’t treat her disrespectfully because she is female, which may provoke her to respond in kind. I have a female friend who is a federal judge and an incredibly nice person, who has really pulled back from trying to mentor her clerks because some of them give her so much attitude. She says she has become much meaner on the job than she used to be as a defense mechanism. She feels that too many law students interpret attempted friendliness as weakness and incompetence, two things that no judge wants to be accused of.

    On the firing thing, though: I worked on a case in which a judge issued possibly the stupidest opinion ever in a copyright case, and when we pointed out the stunning mistatements of law in a motion for reconsideration, (which our opponent didn’t even oppose, that’s how stupid the opinion was) he blamed everything on one of his clerks and fired him on the spot. The clerk had probably done a terrible job, but the fact that the judge would sign off on an opinion without making even a passing acquaintance with the pertinent provisions of the Copyright Act was incredible. The (quickly withdrawn) opinion itself actually cited to the Patent Act, but the judge hadn’t even noticed – oh, the humanity!



  4. Alex says:

    I don’t really get the point of this post. Is it: a) Sloviter isn’t like the “monster” depicted in the book; b) clerks should feel free to write tell-alls about their terrible judges, so long as it’s true; c) the book would have been better if Rao offered “some insight” into the legal system; d) the book would have been better if Rao could actually write; or e) even if Sloviter (or any other judge) is horrible to work for – you have the power to quit, so shut your piehole and go do something else?

    On an aside, you clerked for Sloviter in the mid-80s and Rao sometime in the last few years. Isn’t it possible she’s changed? Isn’t it possible she isn’t the same woman you knew when you clerked for her? And so isn’t it possible that some of the attributes Rao ascribes to her could be in fact true (albeit in an exaggerated form)?

  5. Scott Burris says:

    By weight of anecdote, I stand corrected on my claim about judicial discharges, constructive or otherwise. I overstate the case for judicial vulnerability, but I think Alex’s comment does distill my major points:

    a) True, but I tried not to engage this issue because of the unfair context created by the book (and that’s also why I’ll not address Alex’s concluding point); b) Yes; c) Yes, if one is going to break a custom of discretion the game should be worth the candle; d) Always helps in the literature game; or e) Harsh but true; I’ve seen it done and it has worked out fine for all parties.

    I also want to credit Ann Bartow’s point; we just can’t discount gender in any set of human relations.

  6. Maggie Chon says:

    Like Scott, I clerked for Judge Sloviter in the 80’s (albeit very briefly – not because I was fired) when she became the first female Chief Judge of the Third Circuit. I found her to be extremely fair, rigorous about the law and attentive to the work-life balance of her clerks.

    I never experienced anything even close to a temperamental meltdown in her chambers. To the contrary, birthdays were scrupulously observed with big chocolate chip cookie cakes. And she insisted that her clerks go home at six o’clock, because they had families and/or lives beyond the courthouse: A Radical Idea at the Time. Her “humanistic” office policy stays with me twenty years later as the profession continues to bleeds women when they reach child-bearing years. Twenty years ago, I also observed some dynamics in other judges’ chambers that were what I would call anti-female. I wonder if that has changed in the intervening years. My guess is no, it has not.

    Ok, Alex, so Scott and I are out of date. But I don’t think peoples’ characters change much over time – and I don’t think structural discrimination does much either.

    I have no idea why this female writer would want to be coy about the inspiration for her female judicial character. But based on my experience, the reader should not draw false conclusions.

  7. AYY says:

    “I also want to credit Ann Bartow’s point”

    Uh oh.

    “we just can’t discount gender in any set of human relations.”

    Why not? I suppose you can always try to impose it on something, but that doesn’t mean it’s really there. Don’t know anything about the judge or the author, but from what I’ve read so far, it doesn’t seem like gender has anything to do with it.

  8. anon says:

    From a U.Penn interview which appears at:

    Krieps: And how was your experience as a woman attorney different from what your male colleagues experienced?


    Sloviter: I mean, I know there were clubs where I couldn’t eat at when I became partner, that I couldn’t eat at. Or there was the Stouffer’s restaurants at that time, ah, had a men’s room in the back, which would serve men who were working much more quickly, and I wasn’t allowed to go in there. Unless, every once in awhile, I would, we would put on a little fuss, and they would let us in. I remember that. So, so that it was a disincentive to invite me along with the group to have lunch, from time to time. I just remembered that. [Laughs.] Things come back.

  9. anon post says:

    ann bartow either never met judge sloviter or always takes the offensive on gender bias. guess what, ann? sloviter is a terrible boss and has been for some time, despite a minority of clerks who got along well with her. have you ever worked in the philadelphia courthouse and seen clerks, both male and female, run crying from her chambers? i have. and that makes her as bad a woman judge as many male judges. gender is not the issue. being a bully is.

  10. anon says:

    Scott, I’m glad you admit that you overstated the case for judicial vulnerability. It was a bit absurd to complain that judges have to replace their clerks every year, and have to do so with people fresh out of law school. To the contrary, judges in every court I’m aware of are free to hire experienced, knowledgable, proven, mature attorneys and employ them for years at a time. Judges caught up in the status-quest of hiring the highest-ranked recent graduates from the highest-ranked law schools can only blame themselves for their “vulnerability” to inexperienced and incompetent clerks.

  11. Carla Johnson says:

    I believe Judge Slovitor is a TREASONIST and guilty of MISPRISON OF TREASON.

    Improperly filed paperwork…

    Judging on the same HABEAS CORPUS case two times and changing her mind without a legal argument or DOCUMENTING IT (PACER)

    Denying and dismissing cases without reason.

    The kicker???


    Anyone would like a copy of these orders…

    Did I mention that there was also a two fold rulings in the same court OUT OF HER JURISDICTION?? Can a 3rd Circut Judge rule in a case where there had been no previous proceedings or docketing in The Lower District Court??

    The answer is NO!

    In 2001 Chief Justice Becker placed a percuriam order (in PACER), that stated he could not rule in the same HABEAS CORPUS CASE case for lack or jurisdiction because the lower court had NOT docketed any proceedings from their Habeas Actions. Becker ordered them to docket.

    NOTHING was docketed and Slovitor then took over the HABEAS CORPUS AFTER BECKER AND Judge Newcomber DIED- District Court Judge, WITHOUT JURISDICTION and DENIED IT.

    And Just recently did it AGAIN…. SAME CASE! in 2007.

    Feel free to email me or you can recieve a fax of these orders, Beckers, Slovitors (two of them) and read them in a common sense manner.

    It will be CLEAR.

    MANY and MOST are AFRAID of what the WHOLE truth will do to them so they tell a HALF one in this book.

    Fair to the CLERKS is one thing. How about fair to the Citizens under the law which was wrtitten and bound to protect them.

    signed an average citizen that had to educate herself on the law because idiot law clerks that dont want to tell the real story (Rao) and are just as heartless as the Judge (s) (Slovitor) themselves.


    Lets look at REAL (or mock illegally mailed by the court), DOCUMENTS that can be looked at and compared for the REAL fun to begin!

  12. hhh says:

    I read chambermaid and it was horrible. The judge doesn’t need to be embarrassed about this one, the author does.